Chaminade University of Honolulu

Diversity and Inclusion

Surf Studies

Culture, history and future intersect to create the perfect wave

Surf studies may just well be the new wave in some academia circles. As more scholars publish academic books about the sport of surfing, from “Waves of Resistance: Surfing and History in Twentieth-Century Hawaiʻi” to “Waves of Knowing: A Seascape Epistemology,” universities around the world have begun to embrace the discipline as worthy of research, education and scholarship.

A decade ago, a love for surfing prompted a group of Chaminade faculty members, including Drs. Jim Kraus, Pete Steiger, Michio Yamasaki and Hank Trapido-Rosenthal, to brainstorm the idea of teaching an undergraduate surf class. Yet, it wasn’t until a few years ago, during a casual faculty pau hana, that the notion of “Critical Surf Studies” re-emerged.

“I mentioned it to Lynn (President Babington) and she was interested,” recalls Kraus, an avid surfer since the ’60s and the former publisher of “Hawai‘i Surf & Sea;” from 1980-1984. “Then Lance (Provost) walked by, and I pitched the idea to him, too.”

Eventually, it was Cheryl Edelson, Ph.D., Dean of School of Humanities, Arts, and Design, who presented the topic to the full Chaminade Curriculum Council, which is the final recommending voice in curricular matters with the definitive stamps of approval resting with Drs. Babington and Askildson.

Magazine illustration of native Hawaiians surf-riding (surfing) from an article entitled “Our Neighbors of the Sandwich Islands” in Hutchings’ California Magazine, November 1858.

“Surfing is such an integral part of Hawaiian culture that it deserves to be part of our curriculum,” Babington says. “This program is the first of its kind in Hawai‘i, and it challenges students to explore surf culture’s indigenous origins, its growing popularity globally and its importance to Hawai‘i’s sense of place.”

Duke Paoa Kahinu Mokoe Hulikohola Kahanamoku (August 24, 1890 – January 22, 1968) was a Hawaiian competition swimmer who popularized the sport of surfing.
Duke Paoa Kahinu Mokoe Hulikohola Kahanamoku (August 24, 1890 – January 22, 1968) was a Hawaiian Olympic swimmer who popularized the sport of surfing. 

Celebrating its second anniversary, the Surf Studies Minor examines the broad area of surfing communities and the complicated conflicts that define them, conflicts over access—to beaches, to parking and to the surf zone (po‘ina nalu) itself. Also of central concern is “ownership” of individual waves. It’s a question that Kraus posed in his first class of the semester.

“The idea behind wave ownership and the entitlement that accompanies the belief that one could own any wave signifies a pretty strong misunderstanding of the relationship between surfers and the wave,” Environmental Studies major, Kahana Yokoyama ’23, posted to the class’s online forum. “A good example is merging while driving. If two lanes combine, regardless of where, there is a relatively similar degree of respect when leaving room for others to merge. Taking turns is the most basic basis for this and the same is true for surfing.”

The SURF 480 class uses an asynchronous-learning model, which does not require consistent real-time interactions with an instructor. Students can access course materials—lectures, readings and assignments—on their own time. Although this is an online class, students are required to regularly participate by posting responses to questions posed on the forum. And they must also keep a journal in a conventional bound paper notebook, which they will have to submit regularly, and which Kraus says he reserves the right to read.

“We examine surfing in an academic sense and as part of pop culture,” Kraus explains. “We look at surfing from three perspectives: as a spectator watching surfers from the beach, in the movies and online; as a participant who enters the water and finds a way to the po’ina nalu; and as a literalist, someone who watches weather reports and predicts the surf, promotes surfing, or designs surf boards or clothing.”

According to Kraus, by the end of the term, students should be able to 1) define key terminology used in the interpretation and analysis of surf culture; 2) articulate the relationship between surfing communities and coastal ecosystems; and 3) report on what is of personal, ethical or religious significance in surfing and surf studies by applying Marianist values related to “Education in Family Spirit.”

“This class accentuates my environmental studies, and gives context to the Hawaiian culture and what we read about in texts,” says Yokoyama, who already has a job lined up as an environmental consultant with a Kailua firm. “It teaches you how to apply what you’re learning about surfing to reef health, and how coastal eco-systems interact with surfing as a sport and an industry.”

One of the most famous surf spots in the world, Oahu’s North Shore’s Banzai Pipeline, is the site of one of three of the competitions for the Vans Triple Crown of Surfing title.

While Chaminade students are able to minor in Surf Studies, other universities now offer fully-fledged bachelor’s degrees in surfing, while a few schools even enroll students in post-graduate programs that focus on surfing.

Dr. Gail Grabowsky, Dean of the School of Natural Sciences & Mathematics and Executive Director U.N. CIFAL Honolulu, believes that there’s a lot of activity related to getting on a board and riding the waves. “Many of the Environmental Studies students love the ocean, and are also very conscious of issues like marine debris and materialism,” says Grabowsky. “There are also some wonderful service opportunities with charitable organizations that really look after the ocean, such as the Surfrider Foundation, which has raised awareness and kept wonderful data.”

Askildson has developed a deep connection with surfing since he first learned the art of riding waves off the shores of Daytona Beach in Florida 25 years ago. His affinity towards the surf has grown even deeper since first moving to Australia and now to Hawai‘i.

“I found the Surf Studies program compelling because it is as much about the history of the Hawaiian culture as it is about the history of surfing,” Askildson asserts. “At Chaminade, we serve the people of Hawai‘i and celebrate the culture that makes our islands both unique and special; this program is a striking articulation of that mission and legacy.”

People, Planet and Prosperity

Three-day conference sharply focused on issues of sustainability

We can no longer use the NIMBY (not in my backyard) argument when it comes to advancing future projects. We’ve arrived at a hinge moment when solving our biggest problems—from environmental to social—means we need to start saying YIMBY, yes to some things: from solar panels and wind turbines to battery production and lithium extraction to universal basic income and food security. These are challenges for sure, but left unaddressed, the consequences could spell disaster, as discussed during a three-day conference sponsored by Chaminade University’s CIFAL Center of Honolulu.

On the final day of the People, Planet and Prosperity for a Sustainable Future symposium, Dr. Gail Grabowsky addressed the United Nations Institute for Training and Research’s  (UNITAR) Agenda 2030 for Sustainable Development and its corresponding 17 Sustainable Development Goals (SDG), which cover a vast range of subjects that impact all of us.

“I’ve been steeped in environmental studies for more than 25 years,” said Grabowsky, Chaminade’s Dean of the School of Natural Sciences & Mathematics and Executive Director of CIFAL Honolulu during her keynote address to attendees. “And a year and a half into establishing CIFAL Honolulu, we’ve brought sustainability into people’s consciousness. And we’ve sponsored more than 50 events.”

The CIFAL Global Network is composed of 32 International Training Centers for Authorities and Leaders, all coordinated by UNITAR’s Social Development Program. The strategic locations of the 32 centers, which can be found across Asia, Oceania, Africa, Europe, the Americas and the Caribbean, ensure a global outreach. Each CIFAL—a French acronym for Centre International de Formation des Autorités/Acteurs Locaux (International Training Centers for Local Authorities and Local Actors)—outpost provides innovative training and serves as a hub for the exchange of knowledge among government officials, the private sector and civil society. 

Chaminade President Dr. Lynn Babington with Hawaii Gov. Joshua Greene during the People, Planet and Prosperity Conference.
Chaminade President Dr. Lynn Babington with Hawaii Gov. Josh Green during the People, Planet and Prosperity Conference.

In his keynote address, Hawaii Gov. Josh Green pledged to generate billions of dollars from philanthropy and outside investment to make Hawaii the first state to become fully reliant on clean energy. It’s a familiar stance that Green has taken since he introduced a slew of major climate policy initiatives earlier this year, including a recommitment to the U.S. Climate Alliance and the establishment of a Climate Advisory Panel.

“We have so many people in this room, find a project that will help Hawaii, help us with health care, help us with the environment,” Green told attendees. “I will bring in investors from across the globe because they are interested in Hawaii, but we will still need to do the job.  Be ready. It should be a dynamic few years.”

The presentations indeed reflected this dynamicism, featuring such diverse topics as “Teaching the Importance of the Ocean to Fight Climate Change,” “The First Statewide Initiative to Connect All Public Universities to Advance PK-12 Climate Literacy, Justice and Action,” “Innovation and Sustainability: The Negative Impact of the Protectionist Leadership Style” and “Food Insecurity.”

“Being part of the UN, we bring awareness to sustainable issues, and train people to get involved and to act on sustainability,” Grabowsky said. “We support economic sustainability in the context of still maintaining an aesthetic environment.”

As the only CIFAL Center in the Pacific, the Chaminade campus is part of a region that includes China, Korea, the Philippines and Australia. The CIFAL Network focuses on topics within four thematic axes: Urban Governance and Planning, Economic Development, Social Inclusion and Environmental Sustainability. Each center is locally managed by a host institution, with UNITAR providing academic content, technical support and quality assurance measures for their training activities. This allows each CIFAL to prioritize action in specific thematic axes, depending on local needs and priorities.

“The basic lesson of the Sustainable Development Goals is that human hopes, human aspirations, human fears are all interconnected,” said United Nations Assistant Secretary-General and executive director for UNITAR, Nikhil Seth, during last November’s “XIX Steering Committee Meeting of The CIFAL Global Network at Chaminade.  “You can’t separate them and follow them in discreet ways. The SDGs are like an umbrella of issues and almost everything you can possibly think of are probably covered in the 17 SDGs.”

And that includes Grabowsky’s pet project, “Pono Popoki Project: Malama Management of Free-Roaming Felines.” “Cats can be good for people’s mental health, which is Goal 3 of the SDGs,” said Grabowsky, pointing to a colorful chart that depicts all the SDGs. “And it also teaches our students biology and wildlife conservation.”

PsyD Candidate Realizes Her Dream

Getting through a Transportation Security Agency (TSA) check point is no laughing matter. Nor should it be a crying one, unless you just learned that you’ve just been accepted to your dream university. After flying to Hawaii to visit Chaminade University, Jodie Gerson ’23 was en route home to Las Vegas when she was notified that she was accepted into the Doctor of Psychology Program in Clinical Psychology at Chaminade’s Hawai‘i School of Professional Psychology.

“I got up to the TSA agent and he asked if I was OK,” Gerson laughed. “I told him I was crying out of joy because I just received a call about my acceptance into Chaminade.”

Gerson, who had already held a master’s in Clinical Psychology and another master’s of science in Marriage, Family and Child Therapy, was already an accomplished professional, holding such management roles as Clinical Program Manager with the Nevada Youth Parole Bureau, Director at WestCare, Nevada, and Director of Performance Improvement and Risk Management with Spring Mountain Treatment Center and Spring Mountain Sahara Hospital.

“My wife, Chris, told me that I had met all my goals, except one, which was to apply to doctoral programs,” said Gerson, who is completing her internship with the Superior Court of the District of Columbia this July. “I had several offers across the board, but Chaminade really appealed to me so I flew out to visit.”

Chaminade President Dr. Lynn Babington and Dr. Sean Scanlan present Jodie Gerson with her PsyD degree.

Once on campus, Gerson said the setting was perfect, and she knew immediately that Chaminade was the right fit. Not only did it offer a doctoral program that she liked, but the university checked off another one of her boxes: cultural diversity.

“Oh my gosh, I thought to myself,” Gerson recalled. “This is THE one. After I did my interview, I took a tour of the campus, and it just felt right. I had to get in.”

Her interview was on a Tuesday and by Friday she received the call from the admissions team. Informed of her next steps in order to reserve her spot, Gerson immediately called Chris, and asked if she could send a deposit since she would be in the air.

“I didn’t even have a chance to tell Chris that I was accepted, and now I was asking her to send money to Chaminade,” Gerson smiled. “Even though they gave me a few extra days to complete the necessary steps, I didn’t want to take a chance of losing my spot. There was no way I was letting this opportunity slip by.”

A Certified Expert Trauma Professional who has worked in the field for more than 25 years, Gerson said she was still challenged by the doctoral program, which helped her gain a deeper analysis and understanding of clinical psychology. She also formed strong bonds with her fellow doctoral candidates.

“She has an incredible resume, and has been on multiple boards, including HPA (Hawai‘i Psychological Association) and APA (American Psychological Association),” said Dr. Sean Scanlan, Clinical Psychology Director with the School of Education and Behavioral Sciences. “Her work experience, with adults, adolescents and children, includes assistance and intervention with the homeless, individuals with mental illness, minors in foster care, forensics, youth parole and persons with HIV/AIDS.”

When Gerson returns from Washington, D.C. in July, she will begin a new job with the Department of Health Family Court Liaison Branch at the Hawai‘i Youth Correctional Facility and Detention Home, where she will advocate for teens, and assess risk, needs and protective factors in our youth populations.

She will also continue her studies, seeking to attain her Board certification by taking the Association of State and Provincial Psychology Boards’ Examination for Professional Practice in Psychology (EPPP), a rigorous process that could take as long as her PsyD program.

“Service to the community is one of the values that Chaminade upholds, and it’s one that I strongly believe in as well,” Gerson said “It has been a great experience, and I have no regrets.”

Land-based Pedagogical Approach

Associate Professor of Arts and Design Junghwa Suh, D.Arch, is throwing caution to the wind and subverting the dominant paradigm. Ever since she took an ʻāina-based education workshop conducted by Cultural Engagement Specialist, Kahoalii Keahi-Wood, the Arts Program Coordinator has questioned her pedagogical style, drawing into particular focus her epistemology of interior design and the entire academic process.

“I was inspired by his teaching,” said Suh of Keahi-Wood. “His workshops were free-flowing and discussions came naturally, especially about respect of place and the ʻāina.”

In collaboration with then-visiting University of Maryland architecture professor, Ming Hu, Suh helped develop a new course themed, “ʻĀina-based Design Solution for Indigenous Communities in Hawaii.” The goal of the new course is to propose, test and validate an integrated ʻāina-based design approach that is intended to serve indigenous communities in Hawai‘i.

“The traditional pedagogical approach is process- and goal-oriented, meaning the structure of a course is linear—going from Point A to Point B,” Suh explained. “And because design education is very structured in the process, we sometimes lose the sight of meaning. Yes, content needs to be delivered, but it needs to be delivered meaningfully and beyond a set of skills.”

Associate Professor of Arts and Design Junghwa Suh, D.Arch presented her new course, "Āina-based Design Solution for Indigenous Communities in Hawaii," at the Association of Collegiate Schools of Architecture (ACSA) and the European Association for Architectural Education (EAAE) Conference in Reykjavik, Iceland.
Associate Professor of Arts and Design Junghwa Suh, D.Arch presented her new course, “Āina-based Design Solution for Indigenous Communities in Hawaii,” at the Association of Collegiate Schools of Architecture (ACSA) and the European Association for Architectural Education (EAAE) Conference in Reykjavik, Iceland.

While teaching the Studio Commercial course for seniors’ capstone Environmental + Interior Design project, Hu tasked the students to come up with a design to restore the Maunalua Fishpond Heritage Center in East Oahu, keeping true to the natural elements of the environs. Students had to understand the importance of the Center’s Kānewai Spring, which is “where the mountain gives birth to the ocean.” They also had to take into account the many cultural sites surrounding the spring, including the mākāhā (fishpond sluice gate) and kū‘ula (fishing stone shrine) with an upright Kū stone balanced by a low Hina stone where the fishermen of old would have given offerings asking for a plentiful catch.

“In the client briefing, we learned that the Center is dedicated towards passing down the Hawaiian culture to the next generation through education sessions and volunteer opportunities,” said newly-minted graduate, Maria Bernaldez ’23, who presented her design concept to leaders at the Center. “With that in mind, I implemented traditional Hawaiian hale aspects, keeping open entrances with no doors in places for public accessibility and wood slat ceiling and beams to imitate exposed wooden rafters and roofing made of coconut thatching.”

For her Materiality Interior Design Studio course, Suh assigned sophomores the project of re-conceptualizing the space at The Institute for Human Services’ Women’s & Family Shelter, giving the dormitory areas a more welcoming, inviting design, while mindful of the context and the community.

“They got to know the space, especially the sleeping areas,” Suh said. “I appreciated their research into understanding people, and learning how textural and tactile elements interact with the environment in this particular setting.”

The project spawned a discussion among Suh, Hu and E + ID program coordinator Matthew Higgins, and eventually evolved into an innovative research project that will be presented at the Association of Collegiate Schools of Architecture (ACSA) and the European Association for Architectural Education (EAAE) Conference on June 22-24, in Reykjavik, Iceland.

Titled, ‘Āina-based Design of Emergency and Homeless Shelters for Indigenous Communities, the project’s premise is to address the need for a novel design approach and socially-rich data on native Hawai‘i housing to guide future projects, and to avoid mistakes of the past. According to the abstract, the project tests two design principles that have been overlooked in the development of emergency housing initiatives: the integration of Hawaiian values with respect to the land (ʻāina) and people; and community engagement to generate solutions that are informed by local need.

“The beauty of being in an education environment is that it allows you to explore the meaning of an ʻāina-based design,” Suh said. “You get to know the actual place and not just the physical structure on the property. It’s placing the land in a historical and cultural context, and learning its significance; the overall approach to the design is dictated by the ʻāina and not the place.”

Summer Research Opportunities

La‘a Gamiao ’25 hopes to get a head start on his master’s degree at Purdue University, where he wants to eventually pursue a doctorate in ecology. His first step toward this goal was to accept an eight-week, Undergraduate Summer Research Program at Purdue’s flagship campus in West Lafayette, Indiana.

Laa Gamiao is participating in a research program at Purdue.
La’a Gamiao was accepted accepted to an eight-week, Undergraduate Summer Research Program at Purdue’s flagship campus in West Lafayette, Indiana.

“I leave on June 2 and I have orientation on June 4,” said Gamiao, who will be among the five student-research participants from across the country. “I’ll be conducting research on Aquatic Ecology, studying predator-and-prey interactions in response to chemicals.”

Gamiao is among a group of Chaminade students who have been able to kick-start their graduate studies, thanks to agreements between Chaminade University and fellow esteemed institutions of higher education.

“Chaminade is a member of The Leadership Alliance, a consortium of 32 academic institutions dedicated to addressing the shortage of diversity in graduate schools and academia,” said Amber Noguchi, Ph.D., Chaminade’s Program Director with the Undergraduate Research & Pre-Professional Programs. “Through the program, we’ve built partnerships with universities that want to admit our students into their summer research programs.”

In the past, Chaminade students have participated in programs at Harvard, Yale, Purdue and UCLA—to name just a few. This early exposure to research is invaluable and greatly enhances a student’s graduate school application, particularly for medical schools.

This summer, Alexandra Boyce and Kaila Frank will both participate in Michigan State University’s Summer Research Opportunities Program (SROP). According to the MSU website, the SROP is a gateway to graduate education at Big Ten Academic Alliance universities. The goal of the program is to increase the number of underrepresented students who pursue graduate study and research careers. SROP also helps prepare undergraduates for graduate study through intensive research experiences with faculty mentors and enrichment activities. Boyce and Frank also plan to take short courses in various subjects prior to the start of the research portion of the program.

“We also have at least one student, Tia Skaggs, who will be participating in the Cancer Research Experience for Undergraduates (CREU) program at the University of Colorado Anschutz,” Noguchi said. “This program is focused on projects related to cancer, whereas Purdue and MSU offer a wide range of disciplines and faculty expertise.”

Amber Noguchi, Chaminade’s Program Director with the Undergraduate Research & Pre-Professional Programs, encourages students to participate in summer research programs at various universities.

CREU’s primary goal is to engage scientific curiosity in the next generation of scientists, challenging qualified college undergraduates to consider a cancer-related career in the future. Only 23 college undergraduate students have been selected to spend 10 weeks in the University of Colorado Anschutz Medical Campus’ laboratories.

“Our office encourages students to apply for experiential opportunities like summer research both here at Chaminade and at other institutions,” Noguchi said. “We also encourage our pre-health students to apply for clinical experiences and also pre-health enrichment programs.”

This summer, two pre-health juniors were accepted to the Summer Health Professions Education Program: Joshua Dumas ’24, a pre-med student, who will be attending the UCLA program; and Alexis Martinez ’24, an aspiring dentist, who has a choice between UCLA and Western University of Health Sciences.

To expose students to clinical experience, Chaminade works with the COPE Health Scholars Program at Adventist Castle. Through COPE, students are able to gain 280 clinical hours by volunteering in various departments at the hospital. Students enrolled in healthcare programs require these hours to demonstrate that they understand the field they plan to pursue, and it also helps them be competitive applicants when they actually apply.

“Many Chaminade students—who have pursued health careers in medicine, dentistry, physical therapy, nursing and others—have participated in COPE,” Noguchi said. “We currently have Kelsey Nakagawa ’23, a nursing major, who started the program last year, and has risen to a leadership position there. We also have Kobe Young ’23, a recent Biochemistry graduate, who will be starting this summer.”

Scholars at Sea

Students immerse themselves in culture and history

Seven days. Seven ports. And a lot of history, foreign cultures and sites to absorb in between. These were the main takeaways that Chaminade students, Remo Merlo, Hannah Dyer, Nicole Vontsolos and Kevin Dean, gleaned from their short-term study abroad program this past spring.

Organized by Kelly Treece, Ph.D., Director and Associate Professor of Criminology and Criminal Justice, and Lynn Haff, Director of Grants Development, the scholar-at-sea-like program offered students a glimpse into European, Islamic, Muslim, Jewish, Middle Eastern and Western Asian cultures. The seven-day itinerary aboard the Norwegian Jade embarked from Athens, Greece, and circled the Aegean, Marmara and Mediterranean seas, with Ports of Call in Kusadasi, Turkey; Patmos, Greece; Jerusalem (Ashdod) and Tel-Aviv (Haifa), Israel; and Limassol, Cyprus.

The ruins of Ephesus is 11 miles away from Kusadasi, Turkey, and it is one of the best preserved ancient cities of the world.

“We received a $13,000 Sidney Stern Memorial Trust grant, and we were all set to go in 2020 to Italy, Switzerland and Germany,” Treece says. “And then COVID happened.”

As travel restrictions began to relax in 2022, Treece charted a new course. This time would be different—in location and mode of travel. Also, rather than take a large cohort of students, who would have to pay their own way, Treece would use grant money to cover 90 percent of the program’s cost for four students: two females and two males.

“Coming out of COVID, we knew the students couldn’t afford to pay because they were still recovering from the economic impact of the pandemic,” Treece asserts. “We had limited funds, but we knew we could support four students.”

To qualify, each student was required to hold a current passport, to be in good academic standing and to write an essay explaining why he or she wanted to participate in this short-term study abroad, and how it would propel their future. The answers varied among the freshman, sophomore and two senior students. What was consistent, however, is that they all believed in the educational benefits of visiting different countries and gaining the exposure to foreign cultures.

“When Dr. Treece called and asked if I was still interested in going to Europe, I screamed, ‘Are you kidding me?’” recalls, Hannah Dyer, who was initially denied because she was a sophomore and preference was given to seniors. “It was my first time outside of the Americas so I was excited to see Europe and, technically, Western Asia because of Turkey.”

In preparation for the voyage, each student was assigned a country and tasked to create a travel brochure of sorts, providing details about the respective nation’s history, culture, socio-economic policies, political stability and religion.

“I learned more in the two weeks visiting each country than I would have learned in researching each one,” says freshman Remo Merlo. “They (Europeans) have such a different way of living, and we noticed this right away when we arrived in Athens.”

The Western Wall, also known as the “Wailing Wall” or the “Kotel,” is the most religious site in the world for the Jewish people.

Treece acknowledged her overall goal was cultural immersion for the students, allowing them to explore and develop their sense of curiosity and problem-solving skills. “I’ve chaperoned previous trips to London, England, when I was at another university, but those groups were much larger,” says the one-time police sergeant. “We brought together four complete strangers, and they formed a really tight-knit bond, each relying on the other for safety and awareness.”

And at no time was this more evident when they were in Israel. As peaceful protests choked the streets in Tel Aviv, Treece and Haff were stuck on a bus for several hours after returning from an excursion to Jerusalem. Meanwhile, Dyer and Vontsolos, who were on the same daytrip, had boarded an earlier bus, and only later learned of their chaperones’ predicament once they returned to the ship. 

“We were all texting them to see if they were OK,” Merlo says. “Dr. Treece reassured us they were fine, and everything was peaceful, which was another difference between what we saw in Tel Aviv and what we’ve seen in the U.S.”

Merlo and Dyer have already said they would definitely participate in a similar program should the opportunity again arise. “After college, I plan to move to Europe or Canada,” Merlo says. “And this trip even motivates me more to finish college early, and explore the next chapter of my life.”

Dyer returned to Hawaii on a traveling high, eager to take to the skies once again and return to Israel. “I wish I could have done more,” she says. “Visiting the different religious sights and learning about all the history was an immersive experience. 

“There were no emails and texts to respond to nor phones to answer,” Dyer adds. “We just all hung out and talked about what we were seeing and what we were experiencing. It was great just to hang out and unplug.”